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Mogsmoo
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Buying a 2nd hand motorhome.

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Posted: 05.01.2014  ·  #1
O-) Hi, There,
Just joined and not sure how to use this ,so here goes. My husband are just begining our sixties and thinking of buying a 2nd hand campervan, need a lot of advice as its a lot of money. We'r thinking of the continent for a few months and maybe Spring and Autumn in Ireland. I need all the advice I can get. Thanks.


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 05.01.2014  ·  #2
Hi and welcome to Motorhomecraic, ask away :)


the fat controller
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Re: The..... What did you do to your Motorhome today thread!

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Posted: 05.01.2014  ·  #3
When buying your first motorhome no matter new or used look at plenty, all different makes and especially layouts as no matter what you will have to make some sort of compromise over something. If you buy privately check it out well as there is no warranty, but from a dealer you get a warranty and pay a more.

You are doing the right thing by asking on here as we nearly all have different makes and layouts so keep asking the questions and we will help as much as possible with the advice.

As for your travel plans, have you thought about the opposite way round by spending autumn to spring touring Europe as the summers can be extremely hot in a motorhome depending on where you go.


jacktherev
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Re: The..... What did you do to your Motorhome today thread!

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Posted: 05.01.2014  ·  #4
Well FC I suppose it depends what stage you are at in life. Only a few are fortunate enough to go off when they choose. Even though one has semi retired there's always grandchildren, MIL and other things that are obstacles. I very found it easier to plan my holidays when I was working as I knew there was a window when I had to take them. I don't know where that window has gone now!


the fat controller
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Re: Hi

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Posted: 05.01.2014  ·  #5
My mum has told me, life is for living as you are a long time dead! So when it comes the time for me to retire no matter how many kids/grand kids etc I am off to live in and tour around Europe, they can reach me by skype :lol:


Mogsmoo
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Info on campervan

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Posted: 05.01.2014  ·  #6
Hi, there,we need to know what problems to look for and best advice on right or left hand drive, also best 2nd hand model is most reliable. Fat controller, you are so right 'cos at the end of the day kids and grandkids will all go their own way ,so if you have your health a bit of cash, do it now you never know whats around that corner. 🇧🇭


Mogsmoo
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Info on campervan

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Posted: 05.01.2014  ·  #7
Thanks for advice . :up:


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 05.01.2014  ·  #8
The biggest problem to look for is damp, probably best to get the loan of a good damp meter or get someone to go along with you that has one if you are viewing private, one from a dealer will/should have a warranty.

LAYOUT LAYOUT LAYOUT! sit in it, pretend to live in it, pretend to use the toilet, bring a book and kick back and relax. Watch TV, switch things on and off, view it with the maximum amount of people you will have with you when using it. Get up and walk about whilst everyone is in it. Layout has to be the biggest dissapointment when people buy their first Motorhome (myself included) and don't like it, it can be a costly experience to change so soon after buying.


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 06.01.2014  ·  #9
Ally is right layout is king when choosing a Motorhome.

It is very difficult for first timers to know if they will live in the van or outside it more. If you plan to use it in our climate remember you will spend more time inside than out. With that in mind you will want a comfortable living area.

Another few things to take into account are ;

Bed comfort.
Fixed beds are usually more comfortable than the style you make up with seat cushions. Try making a bed up from cushions and see what I mean.

Body shape.
People will tell you that an overcab bed is great for storage (which it is) but a garage is better as it accessible from outside. Overcabs motorhomes tend to be much harder on fuel.

If you see one you think you like don't jump in and buy it. Come back on here whith the make and model and ask if anyone has one or has had one. An owner will be able to tell you the issues to look out for.
Remember, you are spending a lot of money on your Motorhome and you want to enjoy it.

This is the right place to ask questions. See if any of our members who live near you would be happy to show you round their Motorhome. They will show you why they chose the one they did.


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 06.01.2014  ·  #10
Thanks Mark, really good advice, definetly take it on board. There don't seem to be any campervan shops in Cork or county.I feel my husband may jump on the first one ,if the price is right,withjust a little bit of research.To be honest it's a bit nerve wrecking as we never had a camper van before, and not young ones either. Its great to get good advice from people who know their stuff.Thanks Again.


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 06.01.2014  ·  #11
You could try Westlink in Cork,or Cara campers in Limerick,just to mention a few,there is plenty dealers down the south of the country. :up:


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 06.01.2014  ·  #12
Here's a few to consider,

Closest to you I think would be

Anchor point, bird hill just outside limerick,

As mentioned by Taylor cara motorhomes in Rathskeller I think,

Pat horan outside borrisokane

Pat keogh Bally brittas

East Coast in Wicklow,

Further up north you have Donagheys Letterkenny, (over 100 in stock so good variety to look at in 1 hit)

Not sure if rossdowney (solar willie Derry) sell motorhomes but defiantly service and accessories,

Hagans (not sure exactly where but I'm sure somebody will follow with location)

That's just off the top of my head but more will follow,


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 06.01.2014  ·  #13
Do you know anyone that has a camper that could come with you on a viewing? Or that would show you how to view their own van as though you were going to buy it. Whatever you do, do not jump at the first one that you like. It is a buyers market and there is always another van. Take your time and get it right.

With respect to deciding what you want, research is your friend. DoneDeal is a great place to view lots of vans and most will have 8-10 pictures. Now I don't just mean having a quick little look. I mean a considered look at lots and lots of vans where you look at the detail in the photographs (it's amazing what you can 'see') and the detail in the description. Try to picture yourself in the van on a wet weekend! And think of simple scenarios: Where would you sit if he wanted to watch TV but you wanted to read? OR Where would we store the BBQ and sun-loungers.

When looking at vans on the net start to make a list of things that you see that you like and would want in your ideal van eg awning, garage space, extra security features, TV and satellite dish, reversing camera etc, etc. Make the list as long as you like. Then divide the list into 'must haves' and 'would like' to have.

Assuming you buy a structurally and mechanically sound camper as the others have said the most important thing to get right is the layout. Most other things can be fixed with a bit of cash but it is impractical to change the layout and you have to live with it every time you are in the camper. One thing that you will learn fairly quickly is that everything to do with campervans is about compromise. You might want a newish van with island bed, separate shower, large kitchen, comfortable sitting area, room for the grandkids and great storage but then the van becomes too large, too heavy or too expensive. So you have to start to decide what is important for you and what you are prepared to compromise on.

In your initial research look at everything don't rule anything in or out until you have decided that it is definitely not for you. That said you need to start making some decisions fairly quickly. The two big one are 1) body style and 2) layout. Once you have decided on these it will drastically cut down on the number of vans that you should look at.

Body style
The main styles are A-Class, Coachbuild (over cab), low profile and PVC (panel van conversion). Have a look at examples of each type and think about the advantages and disadvantages of each for you. If you opt for a PVC you will have far few layout choices but they do have their advantages.

Layout
Lots and lots of options. But think about day space and night space. Are you happy to climb into an overcab so that you can have a great big lounge for day use? Some low profiles are set up as a great big lounge but then you have to make you the bed every night and it may not be as comfortable as a fixed bed. Some A-Class campers have a very neat layout that is virtually all day space until you drop the double bed from the roof. This is great but not if you both don't want to go to be at the same time. Do you want a double be or two singles. etc etc One thing that is easy to overlook when looking at interior layouts is the impact on the garage space. Make sure that the layout that you go for also gives you enough garage space. Anyway, the bottom line is compromise - chances are you wont get the perfect camper so the best you can do is to get the best camper for you. So you need to think about your usage pattern. What is right for me is not necessarily right for you even if the numbers using the van were the same.


You can do all of the above online. It is then a good idea to go to a dealer or two that have lots of vans in stock that you can view. You can concentrate on vans that meet your short list criteria and spend some time in them. But then do take a wee look at what else is on offer. Remember, don't buy! This is still just the research stage. Come home think about it and make you final decision on the ideal type for you. You should now be ready to so start considering specific vans. Find a few that meet your criteria then take out that list and see how close it comes to meeting your wish list.

Last of all, but very importantly, especially if you are buying privately make sure you do a finance check. If its on HP it is the bank that owns it NOT the person selling it and NOT the person who buys it! Finance must be cleared before you buy it. So be careful.


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #14
Hi Mogsmoo and welcome to the craic. I have a LHD and it's no great hassle. You automatically start to approach left hand junctions at a slightly different angle and trying to pass a slow moving truck when you're on your own can be a bit tricky but other than that I find no problems. I would prefer to have the steering wheel on the wrong side here where I am familiar with roads, junctions, layouts etc and journeys are relatively short than to have the wheel on the wrong side on the continent. Maybe they should start using tractors as the base vehicle to have the best of both worlds. :D
If you get down around Wexford I'll happily bring you out for a spin and give you all the pros and cons about mine. Happy camping.


jacktherev
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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #15
My Citroen Mehari is LHD as they never made them in RHD. I must say I don't have any problems here and it's much better as Flipperdipper says you are in unfamiliar territory to be the same as the others. I don't think there's any cause for worry on that score.


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #16
We have LHD and hope to change it in the future for a LHD but they are getting harder to get over here.


the fat controller
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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #17
Why not import it from France/Germany, by all reports motorhomes in general are a lot cheaper in Germany.


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #18
Quote by the fat controller

Why not import it from France/Germany, by all reports motorhomes in general are a lot cheaper in Germany.


Not so good when the revenue come looking for their share 13.5% vrt (i think thats the figure)of the value they put on it 🇧🇭


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #19
Quote by the fat controller

Why not import it from France/Germany, by all reports motorhomes in general are a lot cheaper in Germany.


It can be done but the good ol day of being able to bring one in for €50 VRT are long gone (I missed out on that one :( ). Now the revenue will 'make up' a number for the VRT that you owe for importation. At best it will wipe out any saving that you made from buying abroad. [It can be worth it if it's a case that you just cannot get what you want here.] But it could be far worse than just levelling the pitch and you could get hit with a much higher VRT bill than you were expecting. It's very unfair because you have no certainty until you present your van for registration and then they magically compute a OMSP (open market selling price) on which the base the VRT. You then have to pay it there and then before you can appeal.

It's much better and quite straight forward for importing cars. They have a database that you can log onto to check the model, year and milage for a VRT estimate. So you can buy with a fair degree of certainty. Not so for campers. You are in no mans land :bandit: :bandit: :bandit:


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #20
Quote by TAYLOR.

Quote by the fat controller

Why not import it from France/Germany, by all reports motorhomes in general are a lot cheaper in Germany.


Not so good when the revenue come looking for their share 13.5% vrt (i think thats the figure)of the value they put on it 🇧🇭


And thats 13.5% of the price that they choose! Not the price that you paid.


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #21
No they put the price on,you could have got the van for nothing from your rich German uncle,and they price it at the open market price here,which will be high,and as far as i know you have to except the price.

Someone that has done this in the south might be able to fill us in with the details :up:


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #22
Quote by TAYLOR.

No they put the price on,


That's what I said.


the fat controller
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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #23
We dont have VRT :bandit: :D . When you look at it properly you pay the VRT either through the dealer or direct yourself, there is no way around it. You purchase VAT free for export in for example Germany and then pay the VAT in which ever country you register it in.

We have a problem in the North that we cant register a LHD from new, it has to be done in England, just another of the quirks of the vehicle licensing.


jacktherev
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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #24
Well FC what's the definition of New? If the dealer registers it then there should no be a problem.


the fat controller
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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #25
TAYLOR.
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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #26
Quote by Waterman

Quote by TAYLOR.

No they put the price on,


That's what I said.


Sorry Marty,I meant to put yes 📖


jacktherev
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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #27
When I bought my rebuilt Mehari last year I re registerednitnhere. Just went to Ballymena paid I think £55 and got a number. He looked up and there was nomVST on it so,happy days.


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #28
Quote by TAYLOR.


Sorry Marty,I meant to put yes 📖

:up:


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #29
Quote by Waterman

Quote by TAYLOR.


Sorry Marty,I meant to put yes 📖

:up:


:love: :love: :love:


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #30
Quote by Shivster

Quote by Waterman

Quote by TAYLOR.


Sorry Marty,I meant to put yes 📖

:up:


:love: :love: :love:



Shiv will I get you a Wooden spoon (to stir things up) :P :P


Shivster
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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #31
Quote by mad max

Quote by Shivster

Quote by Waterman

Quote by TAYLOR.


Sorry Marty,I meant to put yes 📖

:up:


:love: :love: :love:



Shiv will I get you a Woden spoon (to stir things up) :P :P


A wooden spoon :devil:


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #32
Quote by Shivster

Quote by mad max

Quote by Shivster

Quote by Waterman

Quote by TAYLOR.


Sorry Marty,I meant to put yes 📖

:up:


:love: :love: :love:



Shiv will I get you a Woden spoon (to stir things up) :P :P


A wooden spoon :devil:



Well here in Galway we call it a WODEN spoon,and if you dont leave us alone, mad max will get real mad and go down to you with his woden spoon :devil:


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #33
Ooooops another jackism!!!


Shivster
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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #34
hehehehehe call it what you like.


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #35
Motorhomes were a lot cheaper in Germany, but I think they are cheaper in the south now since the recession, just you have less of a choice and many of the German vans have higher milage.


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #36
Mad max I'm glad that I'm famous and known for something at last!


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #37
:lol: :lol: :up:


Shivster
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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #38
Quote by CHAUSSON

Motorhomes were a lot cheaper in Germany, but I think they are cheaper in the south now since the recession, just you have less of a choice and many of the German vans have higher milage.


Thankfully someone puts the thread back on track.


the fat controller
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Re: Hi

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Posted: 07.01.2014  ·  #39
A lot if the prices both north and south are way out compared to England, never mind going into mainland Europe.


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Re: Hi

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Posted: 08.01.2014  ·  #40
Quote by CHAUSSON

Motorhomes were a lot cheaper in Germany, but I think they are cheaper in the south now since the recession, just you have less of a choice and many of the German vans have higher milage.


I don't disagree with you but it is interesting to examine in more detail the impact of the recession on the motorcaravan fleet (I use the term motorcaravan as that is the official term used by the motortax office in the ROI).

From 2002 to 2007 there was an average growth in the number of motorcaravans taxed (i.e. on the road) of ~20% per annum.

2008 it was 11.5%
2009 it was 9.5%

Now clearly thats a significant slowdown but it was still strong growth considering by 2009 a) the country was now in deep recession b) the base line figures for 2009 was more than 3 times the 2002 figure and c) the total number of vehicles on the roads in 2009 was down ~12%. So despite a slowdown in the growth rate, in 2009 motorcaravans was definitely bucking the trend.

2010 and 2011 saw a serious slow down of 4.6% and 1.6% respectively. Certainly, not good years to be in the trade but the overall fleet was still expanding. But was the 2011 fall from 4.6% to 1.6% a result of the recession or as a result of the fact that as of 1/1/11 you could no longer import a secondhand motorcaravan for €50 VRT, all would now be subject to 13.5% on the OMSP?

Then 2012 tells a really interesting story in that we see the first fall in the overall fleet with a reduction of -13.3% or 1446 motorcaravans. Now that is a serious swing from +1.6% to -13.3% in one year. We are well into the recession at this stage and the impact of the VRT changes should only have had a one off effect in 2011. As in, the VRT changes would not support continued growth but they should have had no impact on the fleet already here. We might have expected a further slowdown, neutral or slightly negative growth but not -13.5%.

At first glance its tempting to say that the recession has finally seriously hit the motorcaravan sector and that 2012 would have been a great year to buy a second hand camper. But that ignores another really crucial factor. 2012 was the first year that motorcaravans in the ROI were subject to a CRW (certificate of road worthiness). I think a lot of people got a nasty surprise during their trip to the VTN centre in 2012, or didn't go because they knew what was in store, and decided to take their motorcaravan off the road while they tangled with the offload/repair dilemma.

My conclusion, the introduction of the CRW test had a far greater impact on the motorcaravan fleet in the ROI than the recession. If you bought a 'great value' secondhand motorcaravan in 2012 I hope you got a genuine one that some poor unfortunate was under pressure to sell rather than a CRW nightmare.

It will be interesting to see the 2013 figures but unfortunately they are not likely to be released until well into the Autumn.

**My analysis only looks at the impact of on the overall fleet and is therefore limited in it ability to explain the impact of the recession or other factors on the average value of motorcaravans. It would also be interesting to look at sales volumes, prices, duration to sale etc but most of that data is unavailable. The analysis cannot show if there was an serious exodus of people trying to get out of motorcaravans, long sales lead times etc between 2007 and 2012 that would have depressed prices. But what it does show is that, even if there was such an exodus, up until 2012 there were more than enough people willing to buy (perhaps encouraged by good value prices) to maintain the overall fleet numbers. But it probably did not feel like that if you were desperately trying to offload a motorcaravan in those years.


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