A bit more oomph would be nice?

 
 
 
 
 
 
tony glenn
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A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 19.04.2022  ·  #1
I posted late last year about our 2004 diesel transit slowing down on gradients.
The problem finally resulted in a full breakdown, and was rectified by replacing the high pressure fuel pump.
End of season finances meant that we opted for a guaranteed reconditioned unit, fitted by a top-class guy who travels the country doing nothing else but Bosch pumps.
The difference was nothing short of miraculous, instant starting, better acceleration, smoother cruising and hill-climbing way less embarrassing.
Which brings me to my question.
The MH still seem slightly slower than it should be going up hils or long gradual inclines.
Maybe it's just an age thing (the van, not me).... it's a 2004 non-turbo 125 T350.with 95000 on the clock, but having said that, it races along on the flat, I'm easing off the throttle more often than not.
The van was recently serviced and checked over, no problems reported.
Would a diesel additive be worth considering? I read about the waste gate sticking or ERG valve needing attention...would either show symptoms this way? Any advice appreciated!


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 19.04.2022  ·  #2
Since yours is non turbo, you can scratch the waste gate off that list. EGRs do get gummed up and various fuel treatments and aerosols for application into the air intake are available but nothing will beat physically cleaning it.

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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 19.04.2022  ·  #3
Being a non turbo engine rules out any noticeable increase in performance... cheapest performance upgrade anyone can do is lighten the load you carry 😉


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 19.04.2022  ·  #4
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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 19.04.2022  ·  #5
Tony I had a 1.6 non turbo diesel VW T3 producing all of 50hp. It was loaded with 4 bicycles a drive away awning, table, chairs, 2 adults and 2 kids. I just drove it foot to the floor all the time, to Portugal, to Switzerland, all over Europe. It was a bit slower but think how much more you see at that speed


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 23.04.2022  ·  #6
Just back from the first trip of the season, also the first trip with the new high pressure fuel pump.
All good, instant starting and generally smoother and more responsive. Better MPG as well.
But....still a little slow on gradients. Everything seems in order mechanically, so maybe 60-70kph max on long gradients is all that can be expected from a 2004 non-turbo 2.4 Ford diesel?
I'm thinking that maybe a diesel additive might just help a little. Possibly not, but at least I can say I tried it.
So, has anyone out there tried an additive and noticed any improvement in performance? Just asking......


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 23.04.2022  ·  #7
Tony, what year is your van? You say 2004 on your initial post?
Double check your assumption that it’s a “non turbo”? I’ve worked on those, sold those and all were fitted with the 2.2/2.4 duratorq Diesel engines and as far as I am aware they were all turbocharged.
Lack of power was generally caused by sticking vanes in the turbo if no other faults were determined on the ECU.

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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 23.04.2022  ·  #8
Quote by tony glenn

Just back from the first trip of the season, also the first trip with the new high pressure fuel pump.
All good, instant starting and generally smoother and more responsive. Better MPG as well.
But....still a little slow on gradients. Everything seems in order mechanically, so maybe 60-70kph max on long gradients is all that can be expected from a 2004 non-turbo 2.4 Ford diesel?
I'm thinking that maybe a diesel additive might just help a little. Possibly not, but at least I can say I tried it.
So, has anyone out there tried an additive and noticed any improvement in performance? Just asking......


Back before everything was turbo'd TB Turbo in the UK fitted a turbo to a friend's non turbo Autotrail on a MB base vehicle.
Maybe that is a route still available, post brexit an' all
Click here TB Turbo

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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 23.04.2022  ·  #9
Quote by JJF

Tony, what year is your van? You say 2004 on your initial post?
Double check your assumption that it’s a “non turbo”? I’ve worked on those, sold those and all were fitted with the 2.2/2.4 duratorq Diesel engines and as far as I am aware they were all turbocharged.
Lack of power was generally caused by sticking vanes in the turbo if no other faults were determined on the ECU.

I took a pic of the manifold area today, I'll try and post it now, maybe you could spot a turbo lurking?
PS Thanks for that link Baguette!


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 23.04.2022  ·  #10
 

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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 23.04.2022  ·  #11
Quote by JJF

Tony, what year is your van? You say 2004 on your initial post?
Double check your assumption that it’s a “non turbo”? I’ve worked on those, sold those and all were fitted with the 2.2/2.4 duratorq Diesel engines and as far as I am aware they were all turbocharged.
Lack of power was generally caused by sticking vanes in the turbo if no other faults were determined on the ECU.



Totally agree Jon,having ran transits for my business I have never had a non turbo beyond year 2000 and am pretty sure that the turbo was fitted before that .

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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 23.04.2022  ·  #12
Yeah, the pre 2001 2.5 came with both. The Bosch cable controlled non turbo variant and the Lucas EDIS ecu controlled turbo variant (that was a pain in the arse).
All 2001 onwards 2.2/2.4 were all duratorq TDDI (non common rail) and TDCI (common rail) but both had turbos.
Tony, yours has a turbo as shown in the pics, have a component mechanic check the variable vanes are free and check for air leaks to the waste gate actuator….. I assume it’s the older type, newer ones were full electronic control.

Quote by ntg


Totally agree Jon,having ran transits for my business I have never had a non turbo beyond year 2000 and am pretty sure that the turbo was fitted before that .

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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 23.04.2022  ·  #13
That's good news, I've got a turbo! Thanks for the confirmation.
I recall about ten years ago our service mechanic told me he'd freed the sticking waste gate. Is that something I could do on the driveway? Also, would a spray turbo cleaner be helpful?


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 24.04.2022  ·  #14
Tony, My honest advice is to take it to a component recommended mechanic with the know how to check & repair.
The turbos of the past 20 years differ from the older ones, the variable geometry vanes do stick and cause an underboost, but this can be attributed to other factors but that usually manifests itself with engine check lights lit up on the dash…. but having it checked & diagnosed properly is the first port of call.

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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 24.04.2022  ·  #15
Quote by JJF

Tony, My honest advice is to take it to a component recommended mechanic with the know how to check & repair.
The turbos of the past 20 years differ from the older ones, the variable geometry vanes do stick and cause an underboost, but this can be attributed to other factors but that usually manifests itself with engine check lights lit up on the dash…. but having it checked & diagnosed properly is the first port of call.

Advice taken, I'll head down to the experts tomorrow morning. A turbo problem might just be the answer to my niggling feeling that something isn't quite right.
Your assistance has been invaluable and is much appreciated, many thanks.
Now.... where can I buy a "Yippee, I've got a turbo!" sticker for the back of MH?

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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 24.04.2022  ·  #16
You will be drag racing away from the lights when you get this sorted

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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 24.04.2022  ·  #17
Quote by TommyS

You will be drag racing away from the lights when you get this sorted


Thanks a lot Tommy....☹
Now I'm worried about the G forces!

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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 24.04.2022  ·  #18
Here's something odd....I've just noticed that it reads 90 T330 on the nearside door, and 125 T350 on the passenger door (it's a LHD German import btw)
In fairness, I've only had the van since 2007 so can't be blamed for not noticing before 🙄 Is there a reason for two different badges, or is one door a replacement?


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 24.04.2022  ·  #19
Quote by tony glenn

Here's something odd....I've just noticed that it reads 90 T330 on the nearside door, and 125 T350 on the passenger door (it's a LHD German import btw)
In fairness, I've only had the van since 2007 so can't be blamed for not noticing before 🙄 Is there a reason for two different badges, or is one door a replacement?


Tony I would say that one of those stickers is refering to a 90hp 3.3 ton gross vehicle weight van and the others referring to a 125hp 3.5 ton gross vehicle weight van.


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 24.04.2022  ·  #20
Which leaves me wondering which one I have? 🤔
Don't laugh, but could it be anything to do with the base vehicle then the vehicle after conversion to a MH?
No, that sounds stupid now I've read it....


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 24.04.2022  ·  #21
 

Here's a pic of the log book in case there's a clue there?


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 24.04.2022  ·  #22
Section F.1 (GVW) shows 3290 so looks like it’s the 90hp 3.3 ton as per ntg s post

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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 24.04.2022  ·  #23
Thanks ☹ I was hoping it was the other one!


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 24.04.2022  ·  #24
Tony it does look like you have the 90hp 3.3 ton one.
Now I would say to get that verified first before taking the next stage, there will be plenty is 125hp engines at breakers yards.
Do not entertain the 135hp engine but the 140 is also reliable.


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 24.04.2022  ·  #25
Like most VLC's issued in Ireland, very limited useful information, that engine number is just the last 5 digits of the chassis number.

Anyway, this is what can be decoded from the chassis number, the 2010 Ford Fiesta/Courier thing is wierd but the rest of it checks out. It looks like a non turbo DI engine rather than the TDDI engine with 90bhp so it's always going to struggle. Has it always been sluggish or has there been a decline in performance?

https://www.vindecoderz.com/EN…TFA3J34773



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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 24.04.2022  ·  #26
This is getting more puzzling by the minute. Yes, it's certainly gotten a bit slower over the years but not enough of a problem to consider an engine change. Reasonably happy with performance apart from on long gradients or short sharp hills, even then it's not as bad as it had become before the new high pressure fuel pump.
What is puzzling is the turbo/non-turbo mystery. Scroll back to the engine pics which apparently confirm it's a turbo model.
Now I'm wondering if it's even the original engine as per the log book?
I'm heading down to my garage guy tomorrow morning with the MH, hopefully we can solve the mystery and plan a way to boost power a little!

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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 24.04.2022  ·  #27
It’s the non common rail turbo charged (TDDI) unit.


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 24.04.2022  ·  #28
That's finally settled then! 😂 Would that set-up apply to the 90hp and the 125hp engine? Please say only the 125hp 🤫


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 24.04.2022  ·  #29
Quote by JJF

It’s the non common rail turbo charged (TDDI) unit.


Seems to be a DI unit which would suggest no turbo? I didn't think they existed but there are references out there or maybe just poor nomenclature from Ford.


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 25.04.2022  ·  #30
DI means it a non common rail (TDDI)
The common rail one was the TDCI.
Bothe the TDCI & TDDI had turbos. The TDDI was fitted with manual control turbo while the TDCI was electronic.
The TDCI is more mappable to gain more power as both pressure and dwell angle on the injectors can easily be altered as well as boost parameters with the electronic control on the turbo.

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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 25.04.2022  ·  #31
I was considering discussing remapping at the garage today (they have the facility) but having read this, maybe having the turbo cleaned (?) and/or the EGR valve blanked off (?) instead might help?

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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 25.04.2022  ·  #32
Freeing up the waste-gate was definitely mentioned after a service a good few years ago, perhaps that's happened again?


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A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 25.04.2022  ·  #33
Quote by tony glenn

I was considering discussing remapping at the garage today (they have the facility) but having read this, maybe having the turbo cleaned (?) and/or the EGR valve blanked off (?) instead might help?


Clean is the first step.

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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 25.04.2022  ·  #34
Just back from garage. Yes, it's a turbo. Initial discussion was about possible remapping, then the mechanic took it for a drive. He came back and said 'something is wrong, too flat from third gear up' (I feckin knew it!) No point in remapping or anything else until we plug in and find out what's happening'
Booked in for Wednesday morning.
No sleep until then of course. ☹


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 25.04.2022  ·  #35
Least you are getting somewhere. If it works out you will be getting somewhere faster


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 25.04.2022  ·  #36
Quote by TommyS

Least you are getting somewhere. If it works out you will be getting somewhere faster


😂 🚐💨💨💨


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 27.04.2022  ·  #37
 


Just back from the garage, pic of computer readout attached.
The good news is we know what the fault is. The bad news is that I'm getting no reply from the guy that fitted the pump last October. He's on the level, so maybe just out of coverage. But, bearing in mind that we're off to France in two weeks time, I need a back-up plan.
I'm assuming any Ford garage could adjust the pump settings?
But does it have to be a Ford garage? We're a good bit away from any Ford dealer, but we have Honda and VW dealerships locally.... would they have the required equipment?


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 27.04.2022  ·  #38
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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 27.04.2022  ·  #39
This is an amazing link which I'm really grateful for. .... I'm reading exactly what's happening and it's a relief to know that it's fixable I even said to the mechanic this evening that I couldn't seem to go faster than 100 kph coming back from Dungarvan!
So, what's next? It looks like a Ford garage job, if so will they have a copy of this bulletin, bearing in mind it's from 2004?


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Re: A bit more oomph would be nice?

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Posted: 06.05.2022  ·  #40
Update as promised. We were put in touch with a local guy who came highly recommended for commercial repairs. He sorted out the timing and all is well.
He also put us in touch with another small outfit that finally fixed the dreaded Transit dashboard cluster fail.
(All instruments zero intermittently)
It's great that there are still small expert operators in the back of beyond, trading purely on word of mouth. Long may they thrive.
So we're ready to roll, a few days in hand...and a couple of nail-biting weeks finally over! Thanks to all for advice/info/support as always. 👍


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